Bios:
CH: My name is Caitlin Hanly and I am in the Masters of Arts in Education program at MSU. My concentration area is science and math education, and I am excited to finish my MA in August! Currently, I teach 8th grade Physical Science in Fairfax County, Virginia.
JB: I’m Joel Berends, MA candidate at MSU with a concentration literacy and language. I am a teacher of grades 10 and 11 English at SPH International, which is located just outside of Jakarta Indonesia.
JA: My name is Ji An. I am in the MATC program at MSU. I’m a sencond grade Chinese immersion classroom teacher in Lansing School District, mostly teaching Chinese language and culture, math, and social study.
LC:I am Lin Cheng, I am enrolled in MATC program at MSU as well. Currently I am also teaching IB Chinese language and culture in a high school in Detroit area. The grade I am teaching is 9th, 10th and 11th.
CH:
As I read through the engaged pedagogy piece, I am caught by a couple of quotes that really get my attention, some in a good way and some that make me cringe.
First, in the opening paragraph, it is stated that “our work is not merely to share information but to share in the intellectual and spiritual growth of our students.” I found this to be an excellent “summary” of my daily classroom activities. Knowing that 8th grade (what I teach) is a year of tremendous social and personal growth, I am wondering how your age levels compare to this quote. Do you find that the growth of students is limited to intellectual, or do you feel as though your classroom is a place for this personal growth as well?
Additionally, as a science teacher, one of the major pushes (and focuses of current reform) is to “teach for understanding”. I believe that this ties in to the pedagogy discussion quite nicely, and especially with this engaged pedagogy. While I feel the focus of this document is more around the teaching of the whole student, it also mentions that it is critical to be “an active participant, not a passive consumer.” What does this mean in your classrooms? To me, it means that students are exploring and “playing” with the information as opposed to sitting, trying to digest the information being lectured to them. Is that true across disciplines? I think Joel, you are in the fine arts department, which means likely much of your work is this hands on “play”, or experimenting, or practicing. Do you feel any connection to this quote?
One part of the document which I very strongly agree with is on page 17, where the “mini-kingdom” is mentioned (about half way down the page). Growing up, I do feel as though I had some dictator type teachers, and I know it was these classes where I did not retain as much information or understanding. I also partially feel as though there many be times teachers need to exercise this “power and authority”- though not go as far as making a classroom into a “mini-kingdom”. One of my major concerns in my classroom is that some of my students do not take me seriously- I am 24 years old, I get mistaken for 8th graders (I was once asked by another faculty member for my hall pass, as she did not realize I WORKED THERE!), and I am not a loud, “scary” person. With this, sometimes I feel as though I need to ensure my students know that while I am there to support their learning, I am also there to ensure they are learning, and occasionally boundaries need to be set. What do you think about this? Is there a time and place for the “mini-kingdom”, or even just this authority? Does the authority tie into the rest of the engaged pedagogy theory? I believe that teachers can have authority while still ensuring students learn in a comfortable environment. I would love your thoughts.
Finally, I will leave you with the quote that caught me the most in this document. It states that, “While it is utterly unreasonable for students to expect classrooms to be therapy sessions, it is appropriate for them to hope that the knowledge received in these settings with enrich and enhance them.” How do you respond to this quote?
I really glad we've chosen to discuss this particular pedagogy. This piece struck many chords in me. Hooks's description of current educators terrified me, especially since I see myself augmenting the horrors. Sadly, I've teetered precariously in many a place where book knowledge trumps social interaction (p.16). The field of academia allures me in prideful ways, in ways which slight meaningful, edifying interaction. Despite my efforts, I too unknowingly hold contradictory ideals "that education should be liberatory" and yet sterile enough to give me "the luxury and privilege" of the absence of any self-actualized requirement" (pp. 19, 17).
I'm also a victim of the pitfalls of compartmentalization. My life and often my belief systems are guarded as separate from the classroom. As a teacher of writing for example, I often expect students to take risks I am unwilling to prescribe to myself. I love writing, especially my writing, and I deeply care about the thoughts and feelings I put to the page, and I have never enjoyed sharing my writing with anyone. I have no doubts my sharing my writing, and even my apprehensions would serve as a great comfort to my students.
"Any classroom that employs a holistic model of learning will also be a place where teachers grow, and are empowered by the process" (p.21).
In my own pedagogy piece I mentioned that "this is where I need to be put and stay put," and "that I often find myself realizing that I’m neglecting to do the things I love and that bring me joy. I pour myself out, silently convinced that it’s selfish to replenish the vessel." Engaged pedagogy is something I deeply want and need. I think if we're honest, this is something we all desire: growth and empowerment, self-actualization.
My questions for you are:
Do you at all feel as if you compartmentalize your teaching? If so, how?
CH:
This is an interesting question, as I think “compartmentalize” can be taken in so many different ways. In the way you describe as teaching being almost like a separate portion of your life, I do not think I do- I often tell my students stories from my own school experiences, and try to make myself human to them. While I do relate to your sense of discomfort in sharing your written work with others, I think there are other ways you can take risks in merging the two separate pieces of your life. I find that putting myself out there is not reason for students to judge who I am as an adult, but rather to question (in a positive way) my challenges and see the growth that I’ve gone through. On the other hand, I do compartmentalize my teaching in terms of the difference periods throughout the day. I use our homeroom time to check in with students in more of a “whole student” way- I spend this time engaging in the conversations of life outside of school- are there family problems, do they love sports, did they just start playing the trombone, etc. That is very different from my normal class periods where I do focus on the academics and leave the personal stuff aside (perhaps why I find the quote regarding “therapy sessions” to be so intriguing). I think my students have begun to realize that classroom time is academic, but I am committed to their overall growth and well being, and if they come to me for help of any kinds I will always do my best to help. So, in answer to compartmentalization, I think we probably all do this, whether conscious or not- some just in different ways than others.
JA:
This is a great question. Well, I try to not compartmentalize in my teaching, as well as construct myself.
I totally agree with that "Any classroom that employs a holistic model of learning will also be a place where teachers grow, and are empowered by the process" (p.21).
I think it’s normal to have self-actualized problems sometimes as an adult. At least, I always feel like I am exploring myself in different ways. Thich Nhat Hanh emphasized that “the practice of a healer therapist, teacher or any helping professional should be directed toward his or herself first. Because if the helper is unhappy, he or she cannot help many people”(p.15). When I read this piece, I feel like “do we really have to require ourselves that much?” I could try, but I don’t think I could reach that level at all! It shouldn’t be limited to the emotion part only, but wholeness in teaching, I think, is and ideal condition that is hard to reach perfectly.
I like how Caitlin is trying to be a human being in front of her students. I also like the idea you separate your teaching into different periods. I agree that we’d better compartmentalize teaching from other stuff during academic time. Thanks for sharing.
What do you make of all this soul food talk? What place does developing belief frameworks and the entirety of a human being have in your classrooms?
CH:
Like I said in response to your question above, I think that the classroom, during academic classes, should be a place for primarily academic learning. In one of the other pedagogy pieces, I believe “Poverty Pedagogy”, it discussed using mistakes as learning experiences. This was a point I agree with. When going back to the Engaged Pedagogy piece, I believe it is important to establish a comfortable classroom environment more so than specifically discussing these belief, or “whole student” issues. If students know that the classroom is safe and the teacher is open, the will be that much more comfortable to make mistakes, learn from them and truly learn about themselves as well as the content.
Have either of you considered professorship? If so, would you break ranks?
CH:
Professorship...no! Well, yes. It’s tricky. I love the age group that I work with now- the 8th graders allow me to put into practice everything that I have been taught. I am not sure I would like working with older students since I really enjoy the relationship building, social aspect of my job. I have thought about teaching one class as a summer extra money gig, but again, I’m not sure it would be fair to my students to have someone not fully committed teaching them. Have you?
JB: The thought has crossed my mind on a number of occasions but for now I’m teaching high schoolers and I love what I do. I am already a bit of a head case, and, if given the opportunity to teach at the collegiate level, I truly fear I would be no better than the detached, dichotomous educators described in the piece. Passing information and pushing publishing does not appeal to me. I was, however, attracted to the sort of positive deviance in the sort of educating going on during the development with Women’s Studies, perhaps I could, in the not so near future, be a part of something like that, bringing a buzz of engaged education to college campuses.
CH:
Joel, your honest self reflection is admirable. While I do not know you, I feel as though I do after reading your questions and answers to this posting. I am surprised by your fear of being a professor. Your seeming confidence in yourself is exactly how I view professors (and I try not to stereotype!)- intelligent, confident, and wanting to pass along something in order to benefit others. In our email exchanges and here, you have provided me with positive feedback, as well as thoughtful questions to consider as I, personally, engage in the information presented- and to me, that is what engaged pedagogy is about. See more at the very bottom of this blog!
_____________________________________________________________________________
“our work is not merely to share information but to share in the intellectual and spiritual growth of our students.”
JA:
I actually tutored American college students Chinese before I came to the US. I didn’t think teaching could be so hard until I came and started to teach little children. Perhaps when you know little children better (it seems like an advantage of a mom or dad teacher:)), they are easier to “deal with” than older students. Also, it’s great to take care of them in many ways other than teaching if you’re a classroom teacher. But I would not mind if I could teach older students one day. Your communication with them can be much deeper, and you probably could learn more things from them.
CH:
I find it interesting that you mention communicating on a deeper level with older students. That was the primary reason I switched from teaching Junior Kindergarten to 8th grade. In JK, I was able to have conversations, but none of them felt real or comfortable to me. It just wasn’t a good fit. What I realized I was looking for was the ability to hold a conversation on a deeper level, whether academic or guidance based. Now that I have been in 8th grade for a while, I can honestly say the conversations I have with my students are the highlights of my day. They really seem to enjoy the conversations as well, which is perhaps the most rewarding aspect of the age level!
JB:
Right out of the gate, this quote resounded in my ears. I remember my supervising teacher from early on in my student teaching telling me: "Joel, your students will not question your intelligence. No one will ever doubt that you have the brains for this job."
I remember many things, obscure things. My wife, students, and colleagues often wonder if my mind is a bank of old Jeopardy questions and answers, but this is how I operate. I think I know now what my cooperating teacher was referring to. She's a teacher deeply committed to her students above all else, and she shares herself shamelessly. She always makes the first vulnerable moves with her students. I do not do this naturally nor willingly. I even have difficulties being vulnerable with wife and closest friends.
It's all too easy for me to bestow information; it's difficult for me to come alongside students and share my processes of growth. This isn't how I want to be as a teacher. I want to be actively involved in the growth of both my students and myself, spiritually and intellectually.
CH:
I don’t think you’re alone in that by any means. In fact, I think many science teachers are there with you in being intellectual junkies but not fully aware of the best possible ways to relay their own work to their students. I think the biggest thing I have noticed across different classrooms in my school is that while being “human” to your students is great, the most important part of this is creating a comfortable classroom environment- one where students can mess up and not be afraid, or write a really “bad” poem and rather than being afraid to sharing it, looking forward to the opportunity to gain feedback and help enhancing their work. There are so many ways to create this safe environment, I think the main goal is to find a way that suits you. If you are uncomfortable sharing yourself personally, then there are certainly other ways to create the environment you want- how, I’m not sure, but I know there are!
JA:
Joel, it’s ok if you don’t want to share personal life with your students. I didn’t know that teachers could share themselves personally before I came to the US. We rarely joked with our teachers before high school. I still loved them and respected them. They were desired to be admired sometimes because they were mysterious. It’s fun to be a mysterious and cool person.
The more I teach, the more I think teachers need to be actors. I always keep my spirit high to make students excited about learning, even when I am upset in life. I made up stories to draw the topic I was about to teach, to make them interested in the topic. You can always find other ways to build your relationships.
JB: Caitlin, I think your spot on with the importance of environment, but I think I could establish comfort much more readily if and when I’m willing to connect with students on a more holistic level. And, Ji An, I definitely tend to be an actor in the classroom. As far as my students know, I spend every waking hour of my life reading, viewing, and talking about Shakespeare and running marathons. Is this an accurate or even a healthy depiction of who I am? Probably not so much, but it sure is fun to go along with.
It is critical to be “an active participant, not a passive consumer.” What does this mean in your classrooms?
JB:
It means: making poetry instead of teaching about poetry, reading books empathetically instead of rationally, learning the power structures of grammar rather than solely for the sake of correctness, learning a work contextually instead of in a vacuum, doing as opposed to talking about how something is done, finding meaning rather than literary rigmarole.
CH:
Joel, I love your specific, detailed answer to this question. It really allows me to envision your teaching and classroom rather than give vague, uninterested answers. I think the “doing as opposed to talking about how something is done” is the key for me in my classroom. In fact, in my other course, we are talking about the meaning of the word “understanding” and what can be done to achieve understanding. I think this action (and know why you’re doing this) is critical in the students understanding of the content being learned.
Is there a time and place for the “mini-kingdom”, or even just this authority?
“While it is utterly unreasonable for students to expect classrooms to be therapy sessions, it is appropriate for them to hope that the knowledge received in these settings with enrich and enhance them.” How do you respond to this quote?
JB:
Personally, I find any sort of "mini-kingdom" to be a sad a lonely place. This is not to say that I don't try to make my own kingdom come on a daily basis, but I think I'd much rather seek a student-centered kingdom because although it's nice to be in control, it's much nicer to not have to listen to the barking of my own voice. Any sort of kingdom I create will be of very little benefit if not created with the help of my students. Working together to create a class culture binds teacher and students alike in mutual respect for one another, making the classroom a harbor for productivity and meaning. Students are seeking something, and what they seek is much more akin to a meaningful relationship than it is the content I often try to push. I can cram content into my small little world but such a world has no meaning, no benefit until I make a space where students feel they can freely step in and stay a while.
CH: Joel, I think the only response to this I have is “agreed”! You were able to expand on this topic much more clearly than I was- thanks!
JA:
“To teach in a manner that respects and cares for the souls of our students is essential if we are to provide the necessary conditions where learning can most deeply and intimately begin.” (p.13). Unfortunately, I did not realize that when I began to teach. There used to be a lot of classroom management problems in my class. I focused on building up my authority by emphasizing the rules, being strict to the disciplines. Once I focus on one thing too much, I cannot spare my mind to other things, such as knowing more about the children, and loving them, especially when I am not a mother yet. As a classroom teacher, the more I know my students, the more empathy and love I have for them. I share my feeling more, and try to figure out their feelings too. In this way, I notice that they are doing better in many ways. I think children at 6 or 7 are very kind innocent. They mostly have empathy to sadness. However, they are not very good at judging people’s feelings as adults. What I usually do is to talk with them with heart, and show my feelings through my expressions and tones exaggeratedly. Once they know my feeling, they usually show that they are caring.
Since part of engaged pedagogy is about the communication between souls with students, I come up with a question:
What do you mean by “professional”? How to be professional when you teach?
CH:
I think the word “professional” can have a variety of meanings. To a businessman, it might mean to speak with proper grammar, dress appropriately and carry ones’ self with “class”. To a plumbing, it might mean being on time, being honest in diagnosing problems and being courteous. To a teacher, I believe being professional means engaging with students in an appropriate way to enhance their learning. A “professional” teacher would not sit back, hand out work sheets or lecture all day. Rather they would, as the engaged pedagogy piece implies, get to know their students unique needs and teach in a way that suits the students, ensuring that the classroom is a place for learning for all, students and teachers alike. This professionalism in teaching, unfortunately does not stop with the daily classroom learning however. Professionalism as a teacher includes building relationships within the school communities, willingness to share ideas with other teachers and communicating respectfully with parents. I think the best way to be professional as a teacher is to treat everyone- students, colleagues, administrators, parents, etc, with respect but also to treat them as the individuals they are.
JA:
Yes, there are academical professionalism, attitude professionalism, social professionalism, etc. I was just confused about the social part. Many teachers had told me “take it easy”, “don’t take it personal”, “stay out of teaching after school” and so on. The truth is, when teaching is part of your life, it’s hard to just “get out of it”. It sometimes makes me feel proud or frustrated. I don’t know if this kind of problems belong to the professionalism part.
JB:
Teaching is a profession. I think I often forget this notion and often wrap myself up in feeling under-appreciated along with my colleagues. I like what Caitlin refers to with regard to relationship. I think my professional role, as the adult world sees it, has to do with the sort of relationships I establish with colleagues, the administration, parents, and the greater community; however, I think my profession by and large concerns the way I conduct myself in the classroom and this could look like any number of things but should look like a few key elements. To me, the profession of teaching demands: I know my stuff and know how to share it in palatable and meaningful ways; I’m sensitive-- culturally and otherwise; I’m a facilitator (especially at the high school level where independence should, in my opinion, reign supreme); I’m accessible, and I’m willing to challenge and be challenged. The list goes on, but I think few people understand what teaching really is and should be in a professional sense because in the end we’re advocates for the growth of children and young people, demographics often without means or understanding for self-advocacy. Too often our role is defined by policy or communities in ways which indirectly support young people; however, I believe that our profession should be determined with students established as the source for our understanding our roles. So to gauge whether I’m professional when I teach, I think you’d have to check with my students, but please do not give them stuffy criteria for judging what is or is not professional.
_____________________________________________
CH:
I think this blog has not only been a discussion of engaged pedagogy, but also allowed me to experience this engagement myself. Through thoughtful questions and answers with classmates, I have been engaged with the content and able to express my thoughts, opinions and interpretations of the content at hand. To me, this is what the engaged pedagogy is all about; not the reading of the article or the passive reflection writing, but the ability to engage in conversation with others and create meaningful discussions to enhance my own learning. I also see this blog as a “safe place”, as I have mentioned before, where I can speak freely on the topics, ask questions for clarity and not be afraid to be corrected. In this sense, I believe my group members to be creating a space (through their feedback and comments to my questions) where I feel comfortable enough to engage in learning. To me, this blog is a perfect example of engaged pedagogy. How do you all feel about the conversation we’re having and it’s practical application to the material we’re discussing? Is it realistic to expect our students to engage of this sort of conversation? Are they motivated to do so on their own? If not, what can we as teachers do to help get them engaged?
JA
To be honest, I did not understand the engaged pedagogy at first. After reading through all your conversations, I got to know more about it. Besides, the way that we are discussing with examples in real teaching makes the pedagogy beyond the theoretical level. This is exactly the way I’d like to learn. I didn’t know that this activity could be so helpful! Thanks to Cathleen.
I agree with Caitlin that this blog is an example of the pedagogy we’ve been talking about. I think it could be a great way for students to develop their discussions on a certain topic (not the 2nd graders though:).
JB:
I think I’m really sold on this engaged stuff! I too have been honored by the things you both have shared. Your reflections on the piece, your thoughtful wisdom, and your experiences have brought a lot to our discussion of this piece. I think this has served as a valuable and formative means for communication and, consequently, has heightened our awareness of engaged pedagogy. In order for this sort of thing to work with our students, I think we must set the bar high.
Just as we have done, our students need to process through dialogue and learn to respond sincerely to one another. This sort of thing has proven to be meaningful for us and was relatively straightforward in its implementation, which means I have no excuses for not using it. I think with a bit of monitoring our students will be able to engage in discussions similar to this but the task cannot seem in the least bit contrived because students can smell that from miles away. When we do not carefully monitor our expectations, our students simply barf out cookie-cut answers, prompting nothing but a cycle of similar vomitted responses. In this case, perhaps an example would be appropriate.
CH: My name is Caitlin Hanly and I am in the Masters of Arts in Education program at MSU. My concentration area is science and math education, and I am excited to finish my MA in August! Currently, I teach 8th grade Physical Science in Fairfax County, Virginia.
JB: I’m Joel Berends, MA candidate at MSU with a concentration literacy and language. I am a teacher of grades 10 and 11 English at SPH International, which is located just outside of Jakarta Indonesia.
JA: My name is Ji An. I am in the MATC program at MSU. I’m a sencond grade Chinese immersion classroom teacher in Lansing School District, mostly teaching Chinese language and culture, math, and social study.
LC:I am Lin Cheng, I am enrolled in MATC program at MSU as well. Currently I am also teaching IB Chinese language and culture in a high school in Detroit area. The grade I am teaching is 9th, 10th and 11th.
CH:
As I read through the engaged pedagogy piece, I am caught by a couple of quotes that really get my attention, some in a good way and some that make me cringe.
First, in the opening paragraph, it is stated that “our work is not merely to share information but to share in the intellectual and spiritual growth of our students.” I found this to be an excellent “summary” of my daily classroom activities. Knowing that 8th grade (what I teach) is a year of tremendous social and personal growth, I am wondering how your age levels compare to this quote. Do you find that the growth of students is limited to intellectual, or do you feel as though your classroom is a place for this personal growth as well?
Additionally, as a science teacher, one of the major pushes (and focuses of current reform) is to “teach for understanding”. I believe that this ties in to the pedagogy discussion quite nicely, and especially with this engaged pedagogy. While I feel the focus of this document is more around the teaching of the whole student, it also mentions that it is critical to be “an active participant, not a passive consumer.” What does this mean in your classrooms? To me, it means that students are exploring and “playing” with the information as opposed to sitting, trying to digest the information being lectured to them. Is that true across disciplines? I think Joel, you are in the fine arts department, which means likely much of your work is this hands on “play”, or experimenting, or practicing. Do you feel any connection to this quote?
One part of the document which I very strongly agree with is on page 17, where the “mini-kingdom” is mentioned (about half way down the page). Growing up, I do feel as though I had some dictator type teachers, and I know it was these classes where I did not retain as much information or understanding. I also partially feel as though there many be times teachers need to exercise this “power and authority”- though not go as far as making a classroom into a “mini-kingdom”. One of my major concerns in my classroom is that some of my students do not take me seriously- I am 24 years old, I get mistaken for 8th graders (I was once asked by another faculty member for my hall pass, as she did not realize I WORKED THERE!), and I am not a loud, “scary” person. With this, sometimes I feel as though I need to ensure my students know that while I am there to support their learning, I am also there to ensure they are learning, and occasionally boundaries need to be set. What do you think about this? Is there a time and place for the “mini-kingdom”, or even just this authority? Does the authority tie into the rest of the engaged pedagogy theory? I believe that teachers can have authority while still ensuring students learn in a comfortable environment. I would love your thoughts.
Finally, I will leave you with the quote that caught me the most in this document. It states that, “While it is utterly unreasonable for students to expect classrooms to be therapy sessions, it is appropriate for them to hope that the knowledge received in these settings with enrich and enhance them.” How do you respond to this quote?
I really glad we've chosen to discuss this particular pedagogy. This piece struck many chords in me. Hooks's description of current educators terrified me, especially since I see myself augmenting the horrors. Sadly, I've teetered precariously in many a place where book knowledge trumps social interaction (p.16). The field of academia allures me in prideful ways, in ways which slight meaningful, edifying interaction. Despite my efforts, I too unknowingly hold contradictory ideals "that education should be liberatory" and yet sterile enough to give me "the luxury and privilege" of the absence of any self-actualized requirement" (pp. 19, 17).
I'm also a victim of the pitfalls of compartmentalization. My life and often my belief systems are guarded as separate from the classroom. As a teacher of writing for example, I often expect students to take risks I am unwilling to prescribe to myself. I love writing, especially my writing, and I deeply care about the thoughts and feelings I put to the page, and I have never enjoyed sharing my writing with anyone. I have no doubts my sharing my writing, and even my apprehensions would serve as a great comfort to my students.
"Any classroom that employs a holistic model of learning will also be a place where teachers grow, and are empowered by the process" (p.21).
In my own pedagogy piece I mentioned that "this is where I need to be put and stay put," and "that I often find myself realizing that I’m neglecting to do the things I love and that bring me joy. I pour myself out, silently convinced that it’s selfish to replenish the vessel." Engaged pedagogy is something I deeply want and need. I think if we're honest, this is something we all desire: growth and empowerment, self-actualization.
My questions for you are:
Do you at all feel as if you compartmentalize your teaching? If so, how?
CH:
This is an interesting question, as I think “compartmentalize” can be taken in so many different ways. In the way you describe as teaching being almost like a separate portion of your life, I do not think I do- I often tell my students stories from my own school experiences, and try to make myself human to them. While I do relate to your sense of discomfort in sharing your written work with others, I think there are other ways you can take risks in merging the two separate pieces of your life. I find that putting myself out there is not reason for students to judge who I am as an adult, but rather to question (in a positive way) my challenges and see the growth that I’ve gone through. On the other hand, I do compartmentalize my teaching in terms of the difference periods throughout the day. I use our homeroom time to check in with students in more of a “whole student” way- I spend this time engaging in the conversations of life outside of school- are there family problems, do they love sports, did they just start playing the trombone, etc. That is very different from my normal class periods where I do focus on the academics and leave the personal stuff aside (perhaps why I find the quote regarding “therapy sessions” to be so intriguing). I think my students have begun to realize that classroom time is academic, but I am committed to their overall growth and well being, and if they come to me for help of any kinds I will always do my best to help. So, in answer to compartmentalization, I think we probably all do this, whether conscious or not- some just in different ways than others.
JA:
This is a great question. Well, I try to not compartmentalize in my teaching, as well as construct myself.
I totally agree with that "Any classroom that employs a holistic model of learning will also be a place where teachers grow, and are empowered by the process" (p.21).
I think it’s normal to have self-actualized problems sometimes as an adult. At least, I always feel like I am exploring myself in different ways. Thich Nhat Hanh emphasized that “the practice of a healer therapist, teacher or any helping professional should be directed toward his or herself first. Because if the helper is unhappy, he or she cannot help many people”(p.15). When I read this piece, I feel like “do we really have to require ourselves that much?” I could try, but I don’t think I could reach that level at all! It shouldn’t be limited to the emotion part only, but wholeness in teaching, I think, is and ideal condition that is hard to reach perfectly.
I like how Caitlin is trying to be a human being in front of her students. I also like the idea you separate your teaching into different periods. I agree that we’d better compartmentalize teaching from other stuff during academic time. Thanks for sharing.
What do you make of all this soul food talk? What place does developing belief frameworks and the entirety of a human being have in your classrooms?
CH:
Like I said in response to your question above, I think that the classroom, during academic classes, should be a place for primarily academic learning. In one of the other pedagogy pieces, I believe “Poverty Pedagogy”, it discussed using mistakes as learning experiences. This was a point I agree with. When going back to the Engaged Pedagogy piece, I believe it is important to establish a comfortable classroom environment more so than specifically discussing these belief, or “whole student” issues. If students know that the classroom is safe and the teacher is open, the will be that much more comfortable to make mistakes, learn from them and truly learn about themselves as well as the content.
Have either of you considered professorship? If so, would you break ranks?
CH:
Professorship...no! Well, yes. It’s tricky. I love the age group that I work with now- the 8th graders allow me to put into practice everything that I have been taught. I am not sure I would like working with older students since I really enjoy the relationship building, social aspect of my job. I have thought about teaching one class as a summer extra money gig, but again, I’m not sure it would be fair to my students to have someone not fully committed teaching them. Have you?
JB: The thought has crossed my mind on a number of occasions but for now I’m teaching high schoolers and I love what I do. I am already a bit of a head case, and, if given the opportunity to teach at the collegiate level, I truly fear I would be no better than the detached, dichotomous educators described in the piece. Passing information and pushing publishing does not appeal to me. I was, however, attracted to the sort of positive deviance in the sort of educating going on during the development with Women’s Studies, perhaps I could, in the not so near future, be a part of something like that, bringing a buzz of engaged education to college campuses.
CH:
Joel, your honest self reflection is admirable. While I do not know you, I feel as though I do after reading your questions and answers to this posting. I am surprised by your fear of being a professor. Your seeming confidence in yourself is exactly how I view professors (and I try not to stereotype!)- intelligent, confident, and wanting to pass along something in order to benefit others. In our email exchanges and here, you have provided me with positive feedback, as well as thoughtful questions to consider as I, personally, engage in the information presented- and to me, that is what engaged pedagogy is about. See more at the very bottom of this blog!
_____________________________________________________________________________
“our work is not merely to share information but to share in the intellectual and spiritual growth of our students.”
JA:
I actually tutored American college students Chinese before I came to the US. I didn’t think teaching could be so hard until I came and started to teach little children. Perhaps when you know little children better (it seems like an advantage of a mom or dad teacher:)), they are easier to “deal with” than older students. Also, it’s great to take care of them in many ways other than teaching if you’re a classroom teacher. But I would not mind if I could teach older students one day. Your communication with them can be much deeper, and you probably could learn more things from them.
CH:
I find it interesting that you mention communicating on a deeper level with older students. That was the primary reason I switched from teaching Junior Kindergarten to 8th grade. In JK, I was able to have conversations, but none of them felt real or comfortable to me. It just wasn’t a good fit. What I realized I was looking for was the ability to hold a conversation on a deeper level, whether academic or guidance based. Now that I have been in 8th grade for a while, I can honestly say the conversations I have with my students are the highlights of my day. They really seem to enjoy the conversations as well, which is perhaps the most rewarding aspect of the age level!
JB:
Right out of the gate, this quote resounded in my ears. I remember my supervising teacher from early on in my student teaching telling me: "Joel, your students will not question your intelligence. No one will ever doubt that you have the brains for this job."
I remember many things, obscure things. My wife, students, and colleagues often wonder if my mind is a bank of old Jeopardy questions and answers, but this is how I operate. I think I know now what my cooperating teacher was referring to. She's a teacher deeply committed to her students above all else, and she shares herself shamelessly. She always makes the first vulnerable moves with her students. I do not do this naturally nor willingly. I even have difficulties being vulnerable with wife and closest friends.
It's all too easy for me to bestow information; it's difficult for me to come alongside students and share my processes of growth. This isn't how I want to be as a teacher. I want to be actively involved in the growth of both my students and myself, spiritually and intellectually.
CH:
I don’t think you’re alone in that by any means. In fact, I think many science teachers are there with you in being intellectual junkies but not fully aware of the best possible ways to relay their own work to their students. I think the biggest thing I have noticed across different classrooms in my school is that while being “human” to your students is great, the most important part of this is creating a comfortable classroom environment- one where students can mess up and not be afraid, or write a really “bad” poem and rather than being afraid to sharing it, looking forward to the opportunity to gain feedback and help enhancing their work. There are so many ways to create this safe environment, I think the main goal is to find a way that suits you. If you are uncomfortable sharing yourself personally, then there are certainly other ways to create the environment you want- how, I’m not sure, but I know there are!
JA:
Joel, it’s ok if you don’t want to share personal life with your students. I didn’t know that teachers could share themselves personally before I came to the US. We rarely joked with our teachers before high school. I still loved them and respected them. They were desired to be admired sometimes because they were mysterious. It’s fun to be a mysterious and cool person.
The more I teach, the more I think teachers need to be actors. I always keep my spirit high to make students excited about learning, even when I am upset in life. I made up stories to draw the topic I was about to teach, to make them interested in the topic. You can always find other ways to build your relationships.
JB: Caitlin, I think your spot on with the importance of environment, but I think I could establish comfort much more readily if and when I’m willing to connect with students on a more holistic level. And, Ji An, I definitely tend to be an actor in the classroom. As far as my students know, I spend every waking hour of my life reading, viewing, and talking about Shakespeare and running marathons. Is this an accurate or even a healthy depiction of who I am? Probably not so much, but it sure is fun to go along with.
It is critical to be “an active participant, not a passive consumer.” What does this mean in your classrooms?
JB:
It means: making poetry instead of teaching about poetry, reading books empathetically instead of rationally, learning the power structures of grammar rather than solely for the sake of correctness, learning a work contextually instead of in a vacuum, doing as opposed to talking about how something is done, finding meaning rather than literary rigmarole.
CH:
Joel, I love your specific, detailed answer to this question. It really allows me to envision your teaching and classroom rather than give vague, uninterested answers. I think the “doing as opposed to talking about how something is done” is the key for me in my classroom. In fact, in my other course, we are talking about the meaning of the word “understanding” and what can be done to achieve understanding. I think this action (and know why you’re doing this) is critical in the students understanding of the content being learned.
Is there a time and place for the “mini-kingdom”, or even just this authority?
“While it is utterly unreasonable for students to expect classrooms to be therapy sessions, it is appropriate for them to hope that the knowledge received in these settings with enrich and enhance them.” How do you respond to this quote?
JB:
Personally, I find any sort of "mini-kingdom" to be a sad a lonely place. This is not to say that I don't try to make my own kingdom come on a daily basis, but I think I'd much rather seek a student-centered kingdom because although it's nice to be in control, it's much nicer to not have to listen to the barking of my own voice. Any sort of kingdom I create will be of very little benefit if not created with the help of my students. Working together to create a class culture binds teacher and students alike in mutual respect for one another, making the classroom a harbor for productivity and meaning. Students are seeking something, and what they seek is much more akin to a meaningful relationship than it is the content I often try to push. I can cram content into my small little world but such a world has no meaning, no benefit until I make a space where students feel they can freely step in and stay a while.
CH: Joel, I think the only response to this I have is “agreed”! You were able to expand on this topic much more clearly than I was- thanks!
JA:
“To teach in a manner that respects and cares for the souls of our students is essential if we are to provide the necessary conditions where learning can most deeply and intimately begin.” (p.13). Unfortunately, I did not realize that when I began to teach. There used to be a lot of classroom management problems in my class. I focused on building up my authority by emphasizing the rules, being strict to the disciplines. Once I focus on one thing too much, I cannot spare my mind to other things, such as knowing more about the children, and loving them, especially when I am not a mother yet. As a classroom teacher, the more I know my students, the more empathy and love I have for them. I share my feeling more, and try to figure out their feelings too. In this way, I notice that they are doing better in many ways. I think children at 6 or 7 are very kind innocent. They mostly have empathy to sadness. However, they are not very good at judging people’s feelings as adults. What I usually do is to talk with them with heart, and show my feelings through my expressions and tones exaggeratedly. Once they know my feeling, they usually show that they are caring.
Since part of engaged pedagogy is about the communication between souls with students, I come up with a question:
What do you mean by “professional”? How to be professional when you teach?
CH:
I think the word “professional” can have a variety of meanings. To a businessman, it might mean to speak with proper grammar, dress appropriately and carry ones’ self with “class”. To a plumbing, it might mean being on time, being honest in diagnosing problems and being courteous. To a teacher, I believe being professional means engaging with students in an appropriate way to enhance their learning. A “professional” teacher would not sit back, hand out work sheets or lecture all day. Rather they would, as the engaged pedagogy piece implies, get to know their students unique needs and teach in a way that suits the students, ensuring that the classroom is a place for learning for all, students and teachers alike. This professionalism in teaching, unfortunately does not stop with the daily classroom learning however. Professionalism as a teacher includes building relationships within the school communities, willingness to share ideas with other teachers and communicating respectfully with parents. I think the best way to be professional as a teacher is to treat everyone- students, colleagues, administrators, parents, etc, with respect but also to treat them as the individuals they are.
JA:
Yes, there are academical professionalism, attitude professionalism, social professionalism, etc. I was just confused about the social part. Many teachers had told me “take it easy”, “don’t take it personal”, “stay out of teaching after school” and so on. The truth is, when teaching is part of your life, it’s hard to just “get out of it”. It sometimes makes me feel proud or frustrated. I don’t know if this kind of problems belong to the professionalism part.
JB:
Teaching is a profession. I think I often forget this notion and often wrap myself up in feeling under-appreciated along with my colleagues. I like what Caitlin refers to with regard to relationship. I think my professional role, as the adult world sees it, has to do with the sort of relationships I establish with colleagues, the administration, parents, and the greater community; however, I think my profession by and large concerns the way I conduct myself in the classroom and this could look like any number of things but should look like a few key elements. To me, the profession of teaching demands: I know my stuff and know how to share it in palatable and meaningful ways; I’m sensitive-- culturally and otherwise; I’m a facilitator (especially at the high school level where independence should, in my opinion, reign supreme); I’m accessible, and I’m willing to challenge and be challenged. The list goes on, but I think few people understand what teaching really is and should be in a professional sense because in the end we’re advocates for the growth of children and young people, demographics often without means or understanding for self-advocacy. Too often our role is defined by policy or communities in ways which indirectly support young people; however, I believe that our profession should be determined with students established as the source for our understanding our roles. So to gauge whether I’m professional when I teach, I think you’d have to check with my students, but please do not give them stuffy criteria for judging what is or is not professional.
_____________________________________________
CH:
I think this blog has not only been a discussion of engaged pedagogy, but also allowed me to experience this engagement myself. Through thoughtful questions and answers with classmates, I have been engaged with the content and able to express my thoughts, opinions and interpretations of the content at hand. To me, this is what the engaged pedagogy is all about; not the reading of the article or the passive reflection writing, but the ability to engage in conversation with others and create meaningful discussions to enhance my own learning. I also see this blog as a “safe place”, as I have mentioned before, where I can speak freely on the topics, ask questions for clarity and not be afraid to be corrected. In this sense, I believe my group members to be creating a space (through their feedback and comments to my questions) where I feel comfortable enough to engage in learning. To me, this blog is a perfect example of engaged pedagogy. How do you all feel about the conversation we’re having and it’s practical application to the material we’re discussing? Is it realistic to expect our students to engage of this sort of conversation? Are they motivated to do so on their own? If not, what can we as teachers do to help get them engaged?
JA
To be honest, I did not understand the engaged pedagogy at first. After reading through all your conversations, I got to know more about it. Besides, the way that we are discussing with examples in real teaching makes the pedagogy beyond the theoretical level. This is exactly the way I’d like to learn. I didn’t know that this activity could be so helpful! Thanks to Cathleen.
I agree with Caitlin that this blog is an example of the pedagogy we’ve been talking about. I think it could be a great way for students to develop their discussions on a certain topic (not the 2nd graders though:).
JB:
I think I’m really sold on this engaged stuff! I too have been honored by the things you both have shared. Your reflections on the piece, your thoughtful wisdom, and your experiences have brought a lot to our discussion of this piece. I think this has served as a valuable and formative means for communication and, consequently, has heightened our awareness of engaged pedagogy. In order for this sort of thing to work with our students, I think we must set the bar high.
Just as we have done, our students need to process through dialogue and learn to respond sincerely to one another. This sort of thing has proven to be meaningful for us and was relatively straightforward in its implementation, which means I have no excuses for not using it. I think with a bit of monitoring our students will be able to engage in discussions similar to this but the task cannot seem in the least bit contrived because students can smell that from miles away. When we do not carefully monitor our expectations, our students simply barf out cookie-cut answers, prompting nothing but a cycle of similar vomitted responses. In this case, perhaps an example would be appropriate.
Wonderful blog!
ReplyDeleteYou referenced the mini-kingdom in your blog and I just wanted to shed light on my own personal experience with it. As teachers I think that is our natural inclination to feel as if we have to set ground rules, otherwise the classroom will be a jungle. As I think back to my own high school and junior high experiences I learned the most from the teachers who set ground rules, stuck with them, yet gave us the freedom to "do" and "question" instead of just being passive learners. I learned more about myself in those classrooms and in response my repertoire of knowledge also increased because I came to those classes ready to work. To an extent classroom management always needs to be there, otherwise the classroom will be chaotic, however there must be a balance, and as teachers we have to find out works works for our classroom, not just for us.
I think that is a very important point...Kids crave (supposedly)structure and consistency. I also thinks it makes the classroom more predictable to have these boundaries, as long as it is for the reasons of classroom management, and not as a teaching style. Good points :-)
ReplyDeleteGreat blog everyone! I like how you discussed that sometimes as teachers we are "acting." We have to get them excited and engaged in topics, and what better way than to change your teaching style a bit to do this! With kindergartners it's so easy and fun to do this, and they really do get involved when they see that I'm excited about a topic too! This also goes along with the environment and creating a space where kids can connect and feel safe with a somewhat consistent schedule.
ReplyDeleteThanks for sharing!
Well done,everyone! I really love the way you organise your blog like dialogues, making it more fun and exciting to read. I really love the way Caitilin describle about the minikingdom. I do agree that if teachers are very dictating, stuents may not be able to learn well, however, many times teachers get frustrated with interruptions and uncousiously fall into a "dictator". That is what we should work on! I like how Ji An refers to her previous teaching experience in China, that makes your point more eloquent. Thanks for sharing with us!
ReplyDeleteGuys, your blog is so sweet. I imagined this conversation is taken in a teacher tea party in a warm spring afternoon. I strongly agree with you guys of being a self-actualized teacher because we all need to grow. And you know when you improve something in your classroom, because you can tell from the exciting engaged learners. About the question of compartmentalization, I found my self compartmentlize my students from their real lives and classrooms. Probably because I was grown from a country in which students do not have much freedom let alone talking with teachers as friends. I found it interesting when American teachers chat about their family lives with their students. I realized it and I tried to be close to my students but from the bottom of my heart, I still see them and evaluate them from a teacher's perspective.This is what I need to work on because no matter how young children are, they can feel exactly how we see them. They not only want to be a good student but also they care if teachers like them as a person.
ReplyDeleteBravo! While reading this conversation, I noticed you discussed several difficult issues that many educators tend to stray from. I believe Joel wrote about compartmentalization and the contrast between your belief systems that you demonstrate in your classroom as opposed to your personal life. I feel the same conflict constantly and it's as though the longer I teach, the more I ask the questions and fail to find the answers. I, too, find that the way I attempt to live my life doesn't always find it's way into my teaching. I encourage my students' to take risks, be tolerant of one another and commit themselves to change and yet I realize that the person in the classroom who is least likely to do this with them is me. I would love to hear more about how you've begun to overcome the compartmentalization and bring more "growth and empowerment" into your classroom?
ReplyDeleteYour blog shows that dialogue can still take place whether in person or through this format. This was a joy to read.